Paydirt Home Locations Permit Map Equipment Permit Services Gold Price Old Forum Archive

Shared Investment Claim Idea


#1

This has been discussed in depth before about all the issues:


http://www.paydirt.co.nz/forums/yaf_postst6456_One-more-claim.aspx#post46821

However I wonder if it was more of a flexible investment company.

Initial cost
$5000 to get a claim (could be more)
10 people needed @ $500 investment each.

6 are Investors Only
Perhaps they come down to hand sluice, pan or detect occasionally, no fee charged. If they have family helping they’re charged $10 a week for each person over the age of 10, due to them being able to move more paydirt, this fee goes towards paying the $5000. 30 days limit per year, if they want more time they pay $20 for an extra week.

4 Dedging Investors, they pay an annual fee of $200 (towards investor profit) per worker for the right to dredge and they need to contribute towards paying off the $5000 investment.

Investors Only could hand sluice, pan, detect for $50 per year, This fee goes towards paying off the $5000 investment. (this is for people that want to spend more than 30 days)

The amount of dredgers vs Investors is just a rough estimate.
Annually the profit for each investor would be upwards of $40, greater than 8% return, it’s a good rate.
These figures would change if there were more investors, and less dredgers.
No one would neccessarily get rich off this, however it could be a full time job for the dredger investors. And could expand to more than one claim.

So at the end of the claim licence there is $5000 cash in the bank, each investor has at least $40 profit (including dredgers). People have used the claim for detecting, sluicing, and on their holidays.

Now there is $5000 for renewing the claim or buying/applying for a new claim.
This money can also be used by dredgers to purchase equipment - subject to approval from investors. They’ll need to pay the money back.

Even though the dredgers pay the most, they have distinct advantages, including being investors themselves & gaining that profit on their investment. Also having the cash to move the claim to a new location.

All investors would be known to each other, likely from the forums. Anyone that wants to invest would have to be well known to the group, come down to meet up and hang out. Subject to approval by everyone else.
Investments would need to be made for a minimum of 1 year - they can only be withdrawn once a year - to help keep the company stable. (more like a term investment)

There would need to be a kind of pass system for dredgers to check, and perhaps an online site where people state usage dates & where they are using the claim (to track usage, monitor correct behaviour).
Let me know if you think its good, bad, or any problems?


#2

great idea. I would be in as an occasional user panning and sluicing. think dredgers should pay a bit more though. they can shift huge amounts of dirt obviously with much higher returns and 4 of them could work a fair amount of ground. $5000 seems fairly low for a claim to. the few I have heard of cost several times that much but no doubt I will be told if im wrong. lol.


#3

having had a claim and parted out all the money for all the Stuffit can be a lot more depending on where it is
doc require money if on there land. easements and ROW s along with linz, local iwi, resource consents and on it goes. $5000 is just from crown minerals. on going costs each year once again doc put their hand out as well as crown minerals
check out the idea the 49ers have in the usa


#4

Well imagine if there were 6 dredgers or more. They would have less paydirt between them.
Also like you say, if the claim cost $10,000 then they would pay much more.

@kiwikeith Yes. It would be a good idea to buy a simple claim to begin with, that is easy access for holiday investors and sluice/pan/detectorists.


#5

It is a great idea- I’m surprised more interest hasn’t come forward.
Funny you mention the claim above in the link on the Marawhenua I’ve dredged it with the previous claim owner a couple of years ago some nice gold and a pretty sexy looking river. However access is a real pig on some of the best bits which would pose a problem for hobby dredgers and there was always issues with claim jumpers etc as half of Oamaru, and surrounds and the Danseys pass camping ground had been raping it for ages prior to the claim. The new owner seams to be doing pretty well though.

I can only speak of Otago, Southland and Canterbury in terms of a claims. There is an advantage of having a claim in Otago and that is

  1. you dont need resource consent for anything up to and including a 6 inch dredge. Provided some other conditions are meet
  2. If the river is not under a section 7 sensitive area (certain native galaxiids) you only really need a mining permit and your away. The ORC has a map of sensitive area so you can easily check
  3. Theres still plenty of good rivers that haven’t been pegged idea for suction dredging
  4. I’ve found the ORC pretty easy to deal with in regards to resource consents ( A lot better than Ecan and environment Southland) and most times a consent is non notifiable.
  5. dredging is usually year round in most cases ( if outside of galaxiid protected area). If you can brave the winters. River flows are pretty stable.
  6. Local iwi- My experience with a number of claims in Otago has been they are all pretty good.

DOC and LINZ access agreement- A lot of the time neither DOC or LINZ actually dont know what areas they administer . I know a few claim owners that have taken the risk and not notified LINZ or DOC and have been fine.

I think the best bet would be limit each dredger to a max of one dredge at any one time for each paying person. Any dredge less than 6 inches is pretty useless at moving material and most hobby dredgers use around the 4 inch size I’ve found. Therefore dont underestimate adding more than just 6 dredgers onto your claim.

From memory there is a syndicate in the Shotover thats claim is only a couple of km long that has about 6 people in the syndicate ( one of the forum users will know more than me) Think how many dredgers you could have it is was say a 10 km long claim.

Speaking of claims- I’m open to to dredgers or sluices/panners who are after access to a claim drop me a line. Claim based in Otago year round access.

Kind Regards


#6

I only linked to that claim because there was a lot of discusion about going in for a shared claim.
I reckon a claim between Nelson & Westport would be more central for any North Island investors, and an equal travel distance for South Island investors. However if the right claim is near Queenstown, that would be fine - nice rich rivers there, and long claims. Probably a secondary claim would be bigger, and could be a new claim.

The first claim would ideally be one that is purchased. All the DOC/IWI/etc is sorted (or at least known about first.

As for claim jumpers, we’d need to invest in a few nightvision deer cameras. Hopefully we’d have a fair amount of people regularly on the claim.

The fact that some claim holders already let people pan/sluice/detect may be a disincentive to do this. Though they will be an investor with a return (I’m sounding like Milo from Catch 22 :laughing:) and all the claim users can help each other out in regards to where is good to pan etc.